Podcast – Episode 0239 – Gods In Everyman — The Ambivalent Son God Archetype

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In this episode, Joel and Antonia finish their short series talking about the god archetypes that show up for some people. This episode details the ambivalent son god in everyman.

 

In this podcast you’ll find:

  • Animas and Anima – Feminine and Masculine Archetypes
  • Goddesses in Everywoman by Jean Bolen
  • Gods in Everyman by Jean Bolen
  • Episode on Vulnerable Goddesses
  • Episode on virgin goddesses
  • Episode on Alchemical Goddess
  • Episode on Gods In Everyman — The Father God Archetypes
  • 3 categories of son gods
  • All sons of Zeus
  • Dionysus
  • God of wine and ecstasy
  • Mystic, lover, wanderer
  • Hermes was the traveler, but Dionysus is a wanderer
  • He was close to nature and had a strong relationship with women
  • God of terror and ecstasy
  • Wild polarities
  • He was loved or hated. Nobody felt neutral about him.
  • He was depicted as a youthful, young man with a wreath around his head
  • Son of Zeus and Semele
  • Zeus saved Dionysus from his mother’s death by cutting him from her womb and sewing him into Zeus’s thigh
  • Dionysus resurrected his mother by going to Hades and retrieving her
  • His worshippers dance and drink in an orgy of celebration to him
  • Hera was Dionysus worse enemy
  • Communion with Dionysus was with frenzied activity that involved ripping apart an animal and eating its flesh
  • He so hated Hera that she was responsible for the madness that followed Dionysus
  • Dionysus becomes a priest to the great Goddess
  • He is responsible for restoring some forgotten Goddesses to the Greek pantheon
  • Eternal adolescent
  • He encouraged ecstasy in women
  • He was a mystic and could go between madness and lucidity
  • Dionysus was raised as a girl because his step-parents were trying to conceal him from Hera’s wrath
  • So people with the Dionysus archetype may look a bit androgynous
  • We are exploring this androgynous space in society right now
  • Spinodal decomposition
  • When you boil oil and water at a specific heat, they become indistinguishable
  • We seem to be entering a very Dionysus period for men
  • Men who have this as an archetype may pursue very sensual indulgences
  • Music, creativity, dance, expression
  • A Dionysus boy can have youngest son syndrome – the baby of the family vibe
  • Tends to identify most strongly with mother
  • He gets called “Girly” a lot
  • Dionysus spectrum of emotion is much grander than the stereotypical male
  • He can’t push down the feelings. They happen in their extreme.
  • That’s why he is drawn to women because they make more room for such extreme emotions.
  • A Dionysus boy may show up at social events with eyeliner and leather pants.
  • Adolescence is marked by wildly falling in love at an alarming rate
  • Alternative work life – creative and different. Rock Stars and Actors
  • Fully expressed Dionysus will struggle with an average job
  • He attracts women into his life who want to mother him  
  • Sex is at the forefront of his life
  • Can become celibate if he is raised in a rigid religious environment
  • Catholic priests
  • Dionysus is very disruptive and dangerous
  • Inspirational mystics and cult leaders are likely Dionysian
  • Charles Manson was most likely a Dionysian character
  • The Dionysian archetype must get the ego right because it can be good or bad
  • Dionysus Archetypes may struggle with committed relationships
  • He may struggle to stay present with his children.
  • Being in the room when his partner gives birth can help him connect with his children thru the mysticism of childbirth
  • Dionysus expressiveness can sound hostile, but he needs to articulate the dangerous thoughts he has.
  • No ambivalence around how one views Dionysus.
  • Unrealistic sense of divine specialness
  • Dionysus wants to be exempt from the mundane
  • Eternal youth
  • Millennial culture is very Dionysus in its tendency to extend youthfulness into adulthood
  • Dionysus often appears with a sort of psychosis
  • The Greek word for spiritism is pharmakeia – root word for pharmaceuticals
  • There has always been a connection between substance and the spirit realm
  • If Dionysus is both the god of wine and mysticism, it makes sense
  • Dionysus is fascinated by the things that are by nature dangerous but also doorways to the beyond
  • If he can’t figure out where his ego fits there is a lot of temptation to hand himself over to substance
  • Navigated carefully, the razor’s edge Dionysus walks between sanity and insanity can be a useful guide to others
  • Psychedelics, Chaos Magic, Cemeteries
  • Ego work is essential for Dionysus
  • Relationships with Hera and Persephone archetypes could be problematic
  • To transcend something you have to accept it first
  • Dionysus must accept himself first which may look egocentric
  • Dionysus has a difficult time with modesty – accept the dark parts of yourself and the elements that make you think you are better than everyone else
  • Dionysus can get very addicted to extreme emotion, so once he integrates the extremes, he loses the oscillations but finds more authentic expressions of the feelings.
  • Dionysus needs to work on developing inner Zeus, Apollo, and Hermes
  • Gods that were more articulate and stable
  • Dionysus needs to find committed love
  • Ariadne became Dionysus wife.
  • She was an Aphrodite type that allowed Dionysus the ability to express himself sensually and fully.
  • Connection outside the bedroom is also vital to a Dionysus growth relationship
  • Bolen ends the book with the concept of 2 emerging God/Goddess figures:
  • Metis was a Goddess long before patriarchy came onto the scene
  • She is the Goddess of wisdom and insight
  • Athena is the daughter of Zeus and Metis
  • Metis was forgotten after the patriarchal pantheons took over
  • We are starting to realize the power of the wise feminine archetype
  • Bolen talks about the son Metis could have had, which would have been the brother of Athena
  • Is there a new archetype of man that has yet to be born on the scene?
  • A marriage of Metis wisdom with Zeus power?
  • A new earth father god?
  • What would it look like if we integrated Metis back into our consciousness?
  • Metis may go meta and be entirely different from anything we’ve seen
  • When we are insistent on our archetype going a certain way, and we push our archetype into society and create us vs. them mentality, we aren’t getting the point.
  • We need to cooperate and integrate all the archetypes
  • Integration not fractures

 In this episode Joel and Antonia finish their short series talking about the god archetypes that show up for some people. This episode details the ambivalent son god in everyman. #podcast #archetypes

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Showing 4 comments
  • Gwendolyn Lee
    Reply

    Totally relate to this energy…and struggling with low self-esteem for how I show up in the world…being so open framed, love for wandering through life, wanting to dwell in the sensory aspects of life, holding space for mysticism, etc. Basically being told I am bad or wrong and questioned at the deepest levels about who I am and what I do in this world. Your ways to grow were very helpful! Thanks very much for the value of modesty for a balanced view of self and becoming the authentic self as a source of inspiration and influence. Self-expression work is key. Stable and direct fashion; on a tension point of the sober mind and present. Love the vision of being a mystic or Avatar and being involved in the process of guidance of others into their true nature.
    I think your 2nd point that having emotional support from women in your life that is constant and committed is also key. I am finding some of this and it is transforming! I think you guys rocked this pod cast! Thanks for your work and sharing it with us.

  • Adam
    Reply

    I started following your podcast right at the onset of this mini series. As a fan of personality systems and one who studied mythology in my youth, I have been captivated these last few months! (I will also say, having visited this website, I finally get the attraction to MBTI)
    Now that we’ve visited all the gods, I can say that I’m really not clearly one or even two of them. I saw a bit of myself in Apollo and Dionysus. The section on Ares tugged at my heart the strongest even though I would never externally see myself as an Ares-type man. But certainly a combination of these three.
    I look forward to seeing what comes next. Thanks again for bringing forth this delightful system. I intend to add these books to my library.

  • Chris
    Reply

    Can a Dionysus marry Hera? Just curious because I know I’m majority Dionysus.

    I was avoiding this series because I didn’t connect with gods and goddesses so this was the first I listened to and OMG this is me. To me there is a reason I randomly gave in on this podcast and it connects with me as an ENTP Orange 9w7. Im a part time comedian and I’m a full time teacher solely because it’s a stage surrounded by kids and it has so much freedom.

    I fear commitment but my girlfriend is a Hera!!! I use this podcast to autocorrect my normal so I don’t drive her crazy all the time.

    Plus I mention some of the thoughts I have and it scares her so idk who to talk with.

    Man this is so em. Yikes.

  • Jessie Visher
    Reply

    Feedback: I LOVED this series (but I’ve always been a nut for Greek mythology and personality so it wasn’t a hard sell :-). Over all I thought it was good. I liked how much it was emphasized in the beginning that you have many of these energies but maybe one or two dominate ones. I felt like this series colored my understanding of personality in a fun but serious way, yet at the same time it didn’t take itself too seriously.

    Since I’ve gotten into MBTI I’ve been trying to figure out why hubby, who is an extremely strong Ti user (INTP), doesn’t test it and every one thinks he is extroverted. And FINALLY I understand he is a total Dionysus. Everything from people either absolutely loving him or absolutely hating him, to be a child-magnet _where ever we go_, can’t hide his emotions AT ALL (which can get super publicly awkward for an ENFJ wife!), wore eye liner in high school, has a Messianic/most humble man in the world complex, fights bad addiction, wore a jacket in high school that quoted I Corinthians 7:1 and yet used to put roses in all the girl’s lockers at 10 years old. He is constantly pushing and expanding my ideas on ALL things and questions everything. As an Aphrodite/Persephone it was his radicalism that attracted me and even now after 12 years I still can’t find a single other man like him (and I’m unintentionally always searching!). This episode made me appreciate him all the more 🙂

    I would push back a little on the way Dionysus was introduced. In the beginning I got more of a “this is person who has to be against organized religion (or gets suppressed by it)” vibe when I don’t think that’s important for this energy (but I should really read the book!). Dionysus just has to think (cause he can’t be convinced) that something is good (then there’s no stopping him) but I don’t think those things have to be a cliche of a bad ass. Just unconventional. If you looked at a bunch of raw facts about my husband you’d think he was more of a conservative Hera! But then not when you met him.

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