Podcast - Episode 0289 - Personality Type Envy (The Grass Is Always Greener)

20 comments

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  • S.U.
  • August 2, 2019 at 12:41 am

  To Sensors: Ni-land is a nice place to visit but you wouldn’t want to live here. Its true if you are the best seed, planted in the right pot and in the right soil at a university undisturbed and safe you may grow to be happy there because they will never take away your water supply but in the real jungle if you dont find your place you can float like a feather in the sky forever. You may get a great perspective below you but you never really get to land. Or in other words if you are an INTJ with dominant Ni and smart enough to get to be a professor at a university where you cant get fired and are protected from the real world then you might be happy because Ni likes safe calm low pressure stable environments. Many INTJs though may not be that smart so they can struggle to fit in to society so they may feel like outsiders all the time observing but not participating. Be happy being a Sensor.

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  • Seely
  • August 1, 2019 at 9:33 pm

  As an INFJ, I very much relate to approaching life from a meta perspective and having difficulty just getting present and enjoying the moment. And in fact, not just enjoying the moment, but fearlessly flinging yourself into it!

  I feel like so much more of a perceiver when around my fairly Te-heavy family. But I certainly feel that lack of extraversion around Ne/Se types. I long for the cohesion my Fe (Harmony) wants, because it can seem like people are just drifting around on different pages, and even though I have the vision, I still lack the step-by-step awareness & discipline I feel Si and Te can bring. (Not to mention charisma, as Antonia said. Which will perhaps come with the growth of my co-pilot, but can feel so fake, yet I get misunderstood and misjudged even when I speak gently and honestly).

  Perhaps some of this will improve as I seek out like types. I love intuitive conversation, as you have mentioned before, and it has been such a pleasure to meet others who are similarly peaceful, easygoing & not wanting to rush through life. To be acknowledged and appreciated for what you bring to the table is a wonderful experience. To just be seen- As Personality Hacker does so well for all of us.

  That said, I do have some moments where I fling myself out of my introversion into Fe and Se, but really wish I wouldn’t then get shushed! It feels like you can’t win in society sometimes, and for us introverts we do need to manage our energy. It can be very difficult to just pull extraverted behaviour out of a hat or on demand, but when it comes naturally we do want to revel in it.

  I feel like I’m at a point in life where I really do need to assess where I’m and what I’m doing. Because I’ve felt the pressure to be different from who I am, and although I’ve grown a lot in some of my weaker areas, I’m not sure the gifts I have are recognized. And it would be a shame to blend forever.

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  • Mary
  • August 1, 2019 at 3:45 pm

  ’- [ ] The podcast was excellent as always and pointed out a lot of things that I had not realized were differences because of the dichotomies and would love to hear more about the functions as well. I am an intj and I grew up in a very N, particularly NT, environment. My dad is an ENTJ, my brother is an INTP, my mom is an ENFP, and I do have a little sister who is an ESFJ. I was, and still am, very close with my family, probably because it was easier to relate to other N’s as many others have attested to in describing seeking relationships outside of their families. I am currently in a relationship with an ISTJ, and have been for 1.5 years, and I am slowly coming to realize that I think my N heavy growing up environment has instilled value and conceptual systems anchored on intuitive thinking in a way the prevents me from understanding and leveraging S qualities. This is particularly true with the Si of my significant other as having Se as my three year old presents fairly clearly the advantages of that. For example, the podcast wonderfully explained the difference between having a meta perspective and being present in the moment, which I had not really realized I was doing. However, from that I conceptually see on a very high level, but don’t all the way really understand, particularly in application, how a meta perspective isn’t always more effective. I know there’s reasons why, but I’m having difficulty finding them and I think it’s at least partially because my Te definitions of effectiveness are basically only centered on N based ideas. This creates problems in my personal life because although I very much enjoy and benefit from my relationship with an istj in the present, when I run future simulations or problem solve, the frameworks I come up with don’t have any place for my istj or his skills and I sometimes wish, in a Pygmalion project way, that he could just develop these skills that fit into this optimized vision that I have. However, I know that he is very intelligent and talented and skilled, and I am beginning to realize that I need to do a massive reframe of my own conceptions regarding sensing types in general, and particularly Si, in order to really understand and be able to leverage the sensors in my life. This is particularly true on an individual level because I mostly understand the benefits of Si on a societal level. With that, how can/will Si help me on a day to day basis? Additionally, how can I discern the differences between Si and Te? because sometimes I feel like the strengths of istj’s that are described can often be accounted for within my own Te. How can I create a life that integrates N and S strengths? How can I reframe my perspectives to understand the benefits of Si?

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  • Erik Bland
  • July 31, 2019 at 11:01 pm

  Thanks to the team at Personality Hacker for putting together this podcast.

  I am a highly-introverted INTJ, and I certainly agree with Joel and Antonia’s comment that (the United States) seems to value extroversion much more than introversion. This can be frustrating, as certain key societal values aren’t intrinsically available to introverts. For example, the idea that “it’s not what you know, it’s who you know” to get things accomplished. Joel and Antonia mentioned that leadership roles, for example, tend to favor extroverts more than introverts. I think the problem is much deeper, in that we unconsciously choose to place such a high value (status, success, and resource gain) on leadership roles, which favor extroverts, over roles that may favor introverts.

  There are also times when introversion isn’t really understood by others, for example when I go out of my way to avoid interacting with people, such as ordering food on a website rather than by phone. Or when I need to rehearse, in my mind, what I will say when I must interact with a stranger at the bank or DMV, for example. These types of behaviors are often met with confusion, or even occasionally hostility.

  That said, I don’t really wish to be more extroverted. I certainly accept that my own personality type has weaknesses as well as strengths, but I like the strengths and I don’t mind (most of) the weaknesses. The only exception might be extroverted sensing, which is my inferior function. Even though I dedicate a lot of effort to physical fitness, and am reasonably competent at physical activities, there are certainly others who exceed my performance at feats of strength, dexterity, or hand-eye coordination, even if they don’t dedicate as much time to practice as I do.

  I’ve commented mainly on weaknesses inherent in the INTJ personality type, but it also has plenty of strengths and I wouldn’t trade this type for any other. However, for the sake of brevity (and because it’s somewhat off-topic), I will save that discussion for another time.

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  • Danielle
  • July 30, 2019 at 4:21 pm

  As far as extroverts having loud energy, I find that I’ve learned to tone it down in some ways. It’s almost like I had to as a survival mechanism. I am a loud person in general, and as I got older I found loudness of voice and energy really put people off, and I felt increasingly isolated and alone as a result. So, I find I have adopted a mix of quieting my energy down and making it as inoffensive as possible. I think this is also part of me being a self-preservation 6. SP 6’s are warm and friendly and seek to build alliances to build up a web of protection. So, I have adjusted my outward persona to be very warm, sweet, and friendly. A good amount of it is authentic, I am compassionate and care about everyone I encounter. As I get more comfortable with my surroudings, I’ll start voicing opinions that might be controversial, offering my honest and uncensored opinion, asking questions, and playing devil’s advocate at times.

  I do find myself rather lucky that I don’t have a very strong preference for extroversion. I can be alone for long periods of time in my own head. As an only child, I learned fairly quickly to entertain myself and exist in a more solitary framework. I enteracted with other people my age, but early in life, most people surrounding me were older. I became very good at conversing with adults, but the trade off was that I was horrifically awkward around my peers. So, I did not have many friends and had trouble keeping friends at times. This only increased my introverted extrovert tendencies. At first, I actually thought I had to be an introvert.

  I probably have the most envy for the thinking types, typically NTs. I find that many of them are far more articulate and to the point than I am.

  I have gotten considerably better at compartamentalizing in the moment, but I am still in awe with how some thinkers can remain calm in the moment and restrain their emotions from flooring the gas pedel and taking over. Of course, the trade off is that sometimes thinkers can be misconstrued as cold or emotionless. The intersting thing is that, even as a feeler, I think I can come across this way at times too. And I think part of that stems from the work I’ve done to compartamentalize my emotions and hold them back momentarily so I can address whatever situation is at hand. Obviously, there is a spectrum and I think I more perceive my behavior as cold than it is actually seen that way by others. I often shy away from intimacy, I am as about as romantic as a fork, and I struggle with responding to geniune displays of emotion towards me. I’m also fairly tough in that very few things offend me or get under my skin. Now, the things that do provoke me tend to unleash an extreme reaction. But there area lot of things that I just feel “meh, whatever” about. But at times, I have wondered if it’s okay for me to even show up that way. It all feels authentic. But I feel like people expect more of a response from me. When my maternal grandmother passed a few months ago, I did not cry at all. I was completely stoic at the funeral. Sure I was sad, but I had had time to prepare for it. In hindsight, I had also been grieving her loss for years before she even became terminally ill—albeit that’s another story. I doubted that I was acting properly actually, and I asked my dad if he thought my behavior was too cold. He said I was fine. There were several individuals there that I was not going to be warm and fuzzy with in any capacity, and I was on guard because I was anticipating someone starting a fight. It’s sad to say I had to be constantly on defense because of a few individuals, but that’s just the toxic situation that exists there. My dad told me I was fine. We actually both thought one individual was overdoing the emotions, almost to draw attention to themselves. And there was some geniune morning and distress. So maybe some stoicism was needed from the close relatives to balance everything out. Then again, my mom is also a feeler and she was rather stoic. But that’s more because she was completely exhausted and was more in her dominant Fe mode of talking to everyone and making sure everything was managed and taken care of. Anyway, I wonder if thinkers feel they have more leverage to show up as more stoic and less emotional. It’s my impression that they do.

  I’ve also seen sensors ignore the patterns and it looks horribly painful. There was one time I all but told a friend about the pattern she was disregarding in her life. Now, I think she was also completely disregarding her auxilary Si, which should have been able to learn from repeated past experiences. Over and over again, she kept dating guys who reminded her of an emotionally abusive ex. And she did not seem to get why she kept getting hurt over and over again. She also adopted some really dangerous thought patterns such as it’s okay if your significant other dictates who you are friends with and the god-awful “boys will be boys” defense some people try to pull to defend guys who either physically violate significant others or attempt to. That one is extremely screwed up because the majority of men are perfectly capable of being respectful in that regard. Not every person my friend dated around that time was bad, but there were enough of them that she got hurt numerous times. Realizing “oh, he reminds me of my ex” should have been an alarm that pursuing a relationship might end in more suffering, but she was taking it as a greenlight. Thankfully, she has since matured and grown up. At the time, I thought she was just a bad judge of character. In hindsight, I think she’s actually a fairly good judge of character who struggles with responding appropriately or just flat out ignores it.

  Also, in some ways I feel grateful that I am a perceiver because I can imagine the society shift away from metanarratives is terrifying. Or at least the uncertaintly feels very destabilizing for some people. Albeit, it’s destabilizing for others; however, I think the J types are more prone to recognizing this and having it impact them on a visceral level. I notice the chaos, but I trust myself to be able to improvise my way through life guided by my own personal values. And I also feel that we have an opportunity as a society and a world to find new systems and new narratives that might work better, and I think the world is also in need of that.

  All in all, being an ENFP is really great. I’m not sure I would chose to be another type. I mean it would be interesting to be an INTJ for the day, but I’m not sure how I would still function as me. I could probably be an INFP without too many major changes, but I feel like if I were another type I wouldn’t be the same person. And I’d like to keep the strengths I have. I am always trying to work on the feelings of envy I have. It used to be really strong. When the concept of “seven deadly sins” comes up, I tend to think “yup, that’s me” when I hear envy. Envy is definitely one of my pitfalls. But I found that my envy has always been less directed at personality type than it is to opportunities and connections and abilities and resources. But that’s just my particular brand of envy. My big thing has always been being envious of people who have large family networks they have positive relationships with, and more specifically people who have grandparents actively invested in their lives. My maternal grandmother did not seem to desire a relationship with me at all from the time I was in my early teens. This hurt understandbly, but it also contributed to envy.