Podcast - Episode 0353 - Social Challenges NT Women Face - Part 1 (INTJ - INTP - ENTP - ENTJ)

42 comments

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  • Karen
  • November 6, 2020 at 7:59 am

  Thank you! seriously, it is so nice to hear and recognize the situations, feeling met in the nt womanhood. I feel comfortable being a a woman, but expectations and how easily I trigger other women and men are exhausting. It was a really good point of how it, at times, feels like some kind of bullying, which can set of all the spiraling theories og how the world is almost plotting against you – but it is acutally/probably just a matter of feelers feeling they are meeting you (and it was so fun about how feelers often think they are the the ones trying to meet everyone elses needs the most, which can kind of feel like a dictatorship or passive-agressive behaviour from the nt perspective)

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  • Maya
  • November 5, 2020 at 6:34 pm

  Thank you, thank you, thank you! I have been a lurking fan of your podcasts for a while but this one has come in the perfect time really – using lockdown downtime to look inwards, untangle some of the wounding and ultimately repair the relationship I have with myself which will in turn lead to better and more authentic relationships with others.

  This has really resonated with me a lot, which shouldn’t be surprising since I’m an NT woman too (ENTP), still wondering what the hell is wrong with me. You have hit the nail on the head with describing how much energy we expend trying to meet other peoples’ expectations of how we should show up in the world and how often enough negative feedback results in self-censorship and trying to force a couple of measly flowers in the front yard while we have a beautiful garden at the back of the house that we are not looking after. I am in my mid 30s now, still struggling with having a healthy level of self esteem, being a freak and owning it unapologetically though I think it might be getting better with age. I used to have this gunshot energy you mentioned but have dimmed it so much (all my own doing) I am struggling to access it again and am living in a way that is discordant with who I really am.

  I feel many other NT women could relate to this. How can you realign with this after many years of pretending to be someone else just to be liked by others?

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  • James
  • November 12, 2020 at 3:34 am

  Maya, first off there’s nothing wrong with you, you’re exactly as you should be and you will not benefit in reality by kowtowing to others in how they think you “should” be other than how you are. I wouldn’t force anything, just let your essence naturally flow and surprisingly there will be many including myself that see you as more feminine than you realize. Femininity is freedom of expression, creativity, any emotions, being silly, being weird, truth is the most feminine women in the world don’t make any sense and act nothing like the main stream societal norms portray women to be and that’s OK, their not meant to, their energy is just meant to be enjoyed. If you would like to learn more about femininity from a woman that doesn’t take any shit and is apologetically herself and doesn’t follow the crowd. I would have you take a look at the femininewoman.com for some study into the subject.

  R/ INTJ

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  • Eli
  • November 5, 2020 at 6:13 pm

  I’ve been reflecting a lot on these types of topics lately, though not always in a personality type frame. This podcast gave some language to some of the feelings I’ve been having. I’ve struggled a lot with building a career and making career decisions, and I’m seeing that part of the problem is that I am so attuned to monitoring the opinions and feelings of those outside of me that I’ve sort of forgotten how to trust myself to make good decisions and build my own ways of thinking, even if these are nonconformist. I’ve lived most of my life in family, friendship, and professional spaces with feelers, and early on I became very accustomed to monitoring everything I say and do for potentially off-putting vibes. It’s frankly ridiculous to think about, putting it into writing. Now, this is related to personality type (ENTP or INTP) as well as some other life experiences that have instilled a solid pendulum dynamic swinging between social avoidance and trying to be part of groups. I’m really starting to feel within my own body (like it’s becoming physical) that I have become totally accustomed to thinking I need to put on a “mask” of sorts for all kinds of social interactions. Working online, I can feel more blatantly the tenseness that characterizes the process of “putting on” my socially acceptable character for interacting with others. At this point in my life, it’s not helping me, it’s hurting—and what’s more, nobody really even knows that this is all going on inside me!

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  • Jen
  • November 10, 2020 at 11:33 am

  Hi, 39yr old INTJ woman here – passionate about wellness (mental, emotional, physical, spiritual) so this translates into strategic life design for me. I believe that my empathy and kinesthetics are highly developed for an INTJ so I don’t feel very “out of touch”. I’m also at the EXTREME end of maestro so most of the time I don’t care that I’m on “the outside”. According to my analyst, about .25% of people have my wiring + combination of aptitude’s. SO, Antonia, I had an ah-hah moment when you described the way there isn’t a lot of modeling in the world for our type – that the world is mostly set up for the masses. That hit home for me as it explains a lot and makes sense. The perspective brought profound relief to me, thank you. Also, I relate to how exhausting it is trying to “do me” and get the results I’m after. I can’t tell you how many times I felt a heavy heart and got emotional because this podcast is so spot on. I feel seen and understood and since that’s incredibly rare for me, being moved to tears was the only natural response (after my occasional eff-bomb expressions because your explanations nailed “it”). This episode articulates, so well, the weight – the struggle. The resulting delegation. In some ways, my adapting has become so second nature that, in part, I think I deceived myself and accepted the “expensive” effort as normal! …I suppose it is for an NT. I too don’t expect anyone to join me in my sandbox.

  I’ve spent the last 2.5yrs dedicated to FEELING because I realized how underdeveloped it was for me and how critical it is to my goal of wellness. I use a therapy called “Reset” and it’s working! My mantra is “Go through it. Not around it”. My lack of emotional intelligence rarely comes from a place of avoidance. Rather, irrelevant to the goal at hand so I compartmentalize. However, I have learned that sometimes – more often that not – if we develop and integrate our emotions better, one’s blind spot begins to shrink and therefore become more effective and accurate. When I am triggered or struggling with emotions I have learned to move towards it with the intention of feeling it MORE, sitting in it – almost wallowing in it. I’ve learned to let it do it’s work and then I ask myself all the “why’s?” (Why do I feel afraid? Why do I feel helpless? Etc.) Then, I commit to carefully upholding my self care and what do yah know – I feel mended and able to get back on track quicker and more effectively. I have found this technique incredibly useful and I’m mentioning it because it has served as medicine for this struggle.

  I’m am also a mother of two boys, 7 and 8yrs. I feel satisfied by my unconventional parenting methods in general. Yet often feel like I wasn’t built for motherhood and find it exceptionally draining. I too recognize that I’m not like other moms. Though I am protective, I don’t helicopter and I’ve often let them learn the hard way after giving a thorough explanation of the consequences of their options. I have learned to press into validating their feelings and guiding them to recognize what their feelings are (“do you feel mad? Do you feel sad? Do you feel frustrated? Etc.) Funny how I’m an adult yet need to call on the same method to sort out myself. I’m not going to lie – sometimes I’m trying to be supportive and present for them and feel almost completely numb, especially if I’m drained energetically which is more often than not.

  I too have always found it easier to relate to men which I’ve had to be careful about if there’s a partner or if I didn’t want them to become attracted to me. I appear VERY feminine (with little effort) because in my early 20’s I noticed my deficit and became an esthetician as a means to work through college – killed two birds with one stone. This was a good call because I have the outward appearance down. But let me tell you, there are times when I’m in a dress and heels and I absolutely feel like I’m in drag in LA!!! Lol

  I would agree that all of this does not feel like I’m wearing a mask or being inauthentic. Rather, like throttling back and being strategic about what I “put out there”. I’m aware of many of my limits so I’m very clear about boundaries and expectations. I have learned how to interact with people (especially women) because I worked in a spa setting for nearly 20yrs. I feel almost cunning and manipulative of my ability to ask just the right questions to find the sweet spot of where we can relate which puts them at ease. When you described the self-hurting technique in which an NT might put herself down to avoid intimidating others. I can relate in a slightly different way: I look for our common struggles and find that it humanizes me so I’m more palatable for others.

  The first time I was told that I was intimidating was in my mid-20’s and the other woman was in her early 40’s. I didn’t understand what I did “wrong” to make someone perceive me so inaccurately – I desired to be approachable and make connections with others. By now, it doesn’t phase me. I am still often misunderstood and I do think I threaten many women and some men with low self esteem in the areas I prevail. I truly am soft and cuddly on the inside and have a tender heart. I’m very generous in my thoughts to others so there are times when it hurts deeply when people assume the worst of me. When this happens, I analyze…find understand….and don’t even bother voicing my experience. We are speaking a different language, after all.

  In closing, I’m happy to be an INTJ. I do feel like it’s a super power. However, with a heavy burden. I would very much like to participate in the NT women’s workshop and dive deeper into these things.