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In this episode, Joel and Antonia talk about the unique social challenges facing NT women personality types (INTJ – INTP – ENTP – ENTJ).
In this podcast you’ll find:
- The common thread between the INTJ, INTP, ENTP and ENTJ female types.
- Your double hit of being Intuitive and a Thinker as a woman.
- What are common challenges NT women deal with?
- Why are their challenges not talked about much?
- Why you are under-represented as an NT woman.
- What do you do when you don’t show up according to societal expectations?
- The overtime NT women put in trying to meet others where they are at.
- Why do NT women keep facing exhaustion and social failure?
- How much energy do you use trying to be more feminine?
- How being told “you’re the problem” affects NT women.
- Why is sisterhood so valued by you, yet often elusive?
- The blending mask that NT women wear.
- What happens when that mask comes off?
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The damaging strategy cycles NT women go through.
- The ENTP woman’s strategies to alleviate offense.
- Why an ENTJ woman diminishes her strong energy.
- The ego hits INTJ and INTP women take from fitting in.
- Why you feel so alone in your female NT challenges.
- How you feel unstoppable inside yet self-diminish socially.
- Why the NT woman’s cure is worse than the disease.
- Overidentifying with your wiring and the drama triangle.
- How do you navigate through your wounds?
- Becoming a bridge through your masculine and feminine energy.
- How you come off in your emotional and thought labor.
- How can camaraderie help you?
- Ways you can grow as an NT woman.
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Podcast - Episode 0352 - Building Self Esteem Regardless Of Type
Podcast - Episode 0354 - Social Challenges NT Women Face - Part 2 (INTJ - INTP - ENTP - ENTJ)
42 comments
Hi, 39yr old INTJ woman here – passionate about wellness (mental, emotional, physical, spiritual) so this translates into strategic life design for me. I believe that my empathy and kinesthetics are highly developed for an INTJ so I don’t feel very “out of touch”. I’m also at the EXTREME end of maestro so most of the time I don’t care that I’m on “the outside”. According to my analyst, about .25% of people have my wiring + combination of aptitude’s. SO, Antonia, I had an ah-hah moment when you described the way there isn’t a lot of modeling in the world for our type – that the world is mostly set up for the masses. That hit home for me as it explains a lot and makes sense. The perspective brought profound relief to me, thank you. Also, I relate to how exhausting it is trying to “do me” and get the results I’m after. I can’t tell you how many times I felt a heavy heart and got emotional because this podcast is so spot on. I feel seen and understood and since that’s incredibly rare for me, being moved to tears was the only natural response (after my occasional eff-bomb expressions because your explanations nailed “it”). This episode articulates, so well, the weight – the struggle. The resulting delegation. In some ways, my adapting has become so second nature that, in part, I think I deceived myself and accepted the “expensive” effort as normal! …I suppose it is for an NT. I too don’t expect anyone to join me in my sandbox.
I’ve spent the last 2.5yrs dedicated to FEELING because I realized how underdeveloped it was for me and how critical it is to my goal of wellness. I use a therapy called “Reset” and it’s working! My mantra is “Go through it. Not around it”. My lack of emotional intelligence rarely comes from a place of avoidance. Rather, irrelevant to the goal at hand so I compartmentalize. However, I have learned that sometimes – more often that not – if we develop and integrate our emotions better, one’s blind spot begins to shrink and therefore become more effective and accurate. When I am triggered or struggling with emotions I have learned to move towards it with the intention of feeling it MORE, sitting in it – almost wallowing in it. I’ve learned to let it do it’s work and then I ask myself all the “why’s?” (Why do I feel afraid? Why do I feel helpless? Etc.) Then, I commit to carefully upholding my self care and what do yah know – I feel mended and able to get back on track quicker and more effectively. I have found this technique incredibly useful and I’m mentioning it because it has served as medicine for this struggle.
I’m am also a mother of two boys, 7 and 8yrs. I feel satisfied by my unconventional parenting methods in general. Yet often feel like I wasn’t built for motherhood and find it exceptionally draining. I too recognize that I’m not like other moms. Though I am protective, I don’t helicopter and I’ve often let them learn the hard way after giving a thorough explanation of the consequences of their options. I have learned to press into validating their feelings and guiding them to recognize what their feelings are (“do you feel mad? Do you feel sad? Do you feel frustrated? Etc.) Funny how I’m an adult yet need to call on the same method to sort out myself. I’m not going to lie – sometimes I’m trying to be supportive and present for them and feel almost completely numb, especially if I’m drained energetically which is more often than not.
I too have always found it easier to relate to men which I’ve had to be careful about if there’s a partner or if I didn’t want them to become attracted to me. I appear VERY feminine (with little effort) because in my early 20’s I noticed my deficit and became an esthetician as a means to work through college – killed two birds with one stone. This was a good call because I have the outward appearance down. But let me tell you, there are times when I’m in a dress and heels and I absolutely feel like I’m in drag in LA!!! Lol
I would agree that all of this does not feel like I’m wearing a mask or being inauthentic. Rather, like throttling back and being strategic about what I “put out there”. I’m aware of many of my limits so I’m very clear about boundaries and expectations. I have learned how to interact with people (especially women) because I worked in a spa setting for nearly 20yrs. I feel almost cunning and manipulative of my ability to ask just the right questions to find the sweet spot of where we can relate which puts them at ease. When you described the self-hurting technique in which an NT might put herself down to avoid intimidating others. I can relate in a slightly different way: I look for our common struggles and find that it humanizes me so I’m more palatable for others.
The first time I was told that I was intimidating was in my mid-20’s and the other woman was in her early 40’s. I didn’t understand what I did “wrong” to make someone perceive me so inaccurately – I desired to be approachable and make connections with others. By now, it doesn’t phase me. I am still often misunderstood and I do think I threaten many women and some men with low self esteem in the areas I prevail. I truly am soft and cuddly on the inside and have a tender heart. I’m very generous in my thoughts to others so there are times when it hurts deeply when people assume the worst of me. When this happens, I analyze…find understand….and don’t even bother voicing my experience. We are speaking a different language, after all.
In closing, I’m happy to be an INTJ. I do feel like it’s a super power. However, with a heavy burden. I would very much like to participate in the NT women’s workshop and dive deeper into these things.
This podcast is going to be life-changing for me, and I am 55. (ENTJ). I am still gathering my thoughts in an attempt to respond in such an eloquent way as you have described my life. . .
But the most important thought I have – surprise surprise – is one that might be controversial :)
and that is, that as I have tried to navigate the lonely waters of having no female friends, I have never once seen them as “the insiders” and me as “the outsider”. The way I have always seen it is that is is a sad way to live, not wanting to discuss and debate controversial topics. So I always saw them as the “Losers” (I don’t mean that personally). Yes, I know that’s what you mean by us not wanting to sound snobby, but I have never ever once, wanted to be like them. So if that makes me a snob, then I am one. – - – Of course, a lonely one. . . . yes.
We’ll talk a bit about being an NT mom in the next podcast. :)
A
Thanks a lot for this podcast. I identify as an NT and just yesterday had the “pleasure” to crash a feeler’s party on a workshop by sharing authentically my feelings (took me some effort) and thought process (easy). Several others felt triggered and responded not to my conclusions but to some minor element of my analysis (obviously carelessly expressed by me).
It took me a moment to realize that the discussion went out of control (and therefore leaving the imho really important points) because of me inadvertently triggering the others. When I later tried to explain my analysis of the situation and group dynamics I was not able to make myself clear since — I believe — the others still listened on their “relationship ears”.
Another topic came up when the group’s teacher told me he had the feeling that I was competing for leadership with him. This is something I heard several times in my life already and am very careful about it. Obviously I come across as domineering and leadership-seeking at times and I am always puzzled about it since I know how “un-domineering” I am (feeling pretty soft on the inside).
I only jump into leadership roles when I feel a leadership vacuum and want to get stuff done and don’t waste time and resources. And there was a moment yesterday where I definitely perceived such a vacuum…
Anyway, thanks a lot for the podcast, I felt understood.
I really enjoyed the podcast and identified with a lot/most of what you were saying. I’ve been a teacher for a lot of my life and struggled intensely with the emotional side of teaching (individual lessons). I felt affinity with the subject I taught and had a lot of ideas but forming bonds with a majority of students who had entirely different needs from myself was literally a nightmare. Yes, overtime I guess I learned to some extent how to do it, but it’s such a massive task I just don’t believe anyone should have to go through that without specific tuition themselves in this issue. Thanks for the experience of sharing what it’s like to live without a framework for all of this.